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So is UP pretty much dead?

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Some people think TVTs are played exclusively to win, and everyone's goal is to get as high a kill count as possible.

 

Some people think that about every mission nowadays.

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I've been away recently due to being busy with other projects/pursuits, so a lot of things may have happened recently that I'm not aware of.

 

That said I would be in support of pushing to switch to ArmA 3 (solidify content, mods, and such) and focusing on regular weekly or bi-weekly "playing times" such as those on Tuesdays and Fridays (whatever the events may eventually be called and maybe not necessarily on those days) rather than trying to solve the problems of "throughout the week" play, at least in the "short term".

 

No, I do not think that alone will improve "quality of play", but I think it will at least make those problems easier to look at and solve.

 

I think what would really help is having a semi-consistent group of regulars playing on a known schedule again, and have a significant portion of the community who are playing the same sessions and most importantly "seeing the same game".

When that's been achieved again the community would be in a much better position to make decisions on Barrier To Entry, Events, or whatever other changes may or may not have to take place.

 

If there isn't a coherent view on how to solve the "problem" then I would think it would at least help to try to get into a position where a coherent view can be found, then worry about attempting solving the "problem" afterwards.

Edited by Professor Paul1290

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I've also never understood why so many people think TVT means derp and fuck tactical play.  

 

I've found that it's usually the kind of mission the TVT is. I remember when I first played here that there seemed to be no cut and dry attack and defend missions. All of the TVTs were high speed low drag, fun interesting, small non-conventional vs conventional types of missions. This generally meant that the gameplay was something other than "attack here/defend here."

 

I could go on and on on what makes a shit mission vs a good one. But in general, the missions that were played/created were not the kinds of missions that promoted the kind of experience most people come to play here for.

 

p.s. Fuck HVTs, fuck meeting engagements, fuck assets, and fuck asset heavy HVT meeting engagements in dense urban terrain.

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I remember when I first played here[...]"

Nostalgia is a thing. There were just as many shit missions back when you started playing, whenever that could be, as there are now. The difference is that there are few new missions nowadays.

 

p.s. Fuck HVTs[...]

Depends on mission design.

 

fuck meeting engagements [...]

Meeting engagements are an excellent game mode, since they provide a large amount of flexibility for the leader, as well as being highly replayable.

 

 fuck assets[...]

You are wrong. Assets are what provide variety to missions.

 

 [...]and fuck asset heavy HVT meeting engagements in dense urban terrain.

But Kirabo was fun!!!!!! 

 

</sarcasm>

 

Edited by KmO

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Looks like it is way easier and way more comfortable to put the blame to missions, mission makers and their work, instead of accepting the fact that it is not their fault but OURS!

The mistake lies upon the shoulders of every player and every regular and everyone else who is connected to ArmA and watched while the QUALITY of our PLAYERS decreased from session to session, instead of going against that movement with all their might.

And what astonishes me even more is the fact that people seem to not understand what the issue in here is. For example look at the meme threads last posts.

 

I do not know how many times I already said it and might will continue to:

 

It is NOT about the missions!

It is about each single player!

 

A mission is a tool. A tool used to apply MilSim Environment.

A mission does not 'support' derping! That is bullshit. A mission might be designed badly or might miss balance.

PLAYERS derp!

PLAYERS do NOT report derpers!

PLAYERS do not train themself!

PLAYERS do not use proper radio communications!

 

And I could continue this list until walltext!

 

If I would be a mission maker and must listen to all thoose comments made in the mission selection screen "nah dis shit" "no - bad mission" "oh god no" and what not, I would NEVER EVER provide a mission to this community again!

We can be lucky that we have that many missions on our primary! Even if some of them are overplayed and we could need some more missions with more degree of freedom.

 

Yes, there might be missions which do not fit a standard to support MilSim EV but thoose can be removed or altered if necessary (For example Domination for numerous reasons. In its current state it does just not fit UnitedOperation ArmA servers).

 

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

We can continue to complain about the state of ArmA in UO or actually change something.

The issue:

 

What can the regular player base do, to prevent further deterioration of each players (poeple who populate the SRV1s regardless of ArmA2 or 3) individual milsim skills?

And how can we encourage other players to constantly improve themselfs or at least encourage them to constantly check if their level of gameplay quality is still appropriate?

All that without getting in conflict with the UO SOPs or putting additional work on existant UO-Structures like the UOTC.

 

 

My 2 cents on this:

 

- Back to immidiate reporting of players not following the SOPs after being warned. No matter which rank or how popular they might be.

- Establish the knowledge that QUALITY is in ALL forms to be preffered before QUANTITY.

- ALL regular ArmA players should start to make use of their right to controll slotting in an appropriate manner to ensure a working and competent (MILSIM) COC [What btw should be the Admins PRIMARY target before anything else].

- Reestablish the Fire Team Parctical sessions and promote them, promote training at all of what ever kind.

 

 

 

We need to start to change ourselfs or we will end up with the same Drama in ArmA3 more sooner than later.

 

 

- Pax

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Lots of replys.

 

 

Like I said, I could go into more depth but I will just give short reasons and clarify why I dislike these things in particular.

 

HVTs:

Gameplay focuses around an individual(s) and there is no way to ensure that they will go out of their way to ruin a mission for everyone. A mission ending prematurely is dependent on how competent a person(s) is or how great of an internet connection they have. There are just a lot of uncontrollable variables when it comes to these types of missions.

 

Meeting Engagements:

I dislike these because they are typically lost by the side who gets bored first and abandon their "well thought-out, in-depth" defense. There are also occasions where both sides completely miss each other and just spend the duration of the mission on a lovely nature/urban hike/drive.

 

Assets:

Multiple assets create a rock, paper, scissors scenario where the only way to win is the reliance on a specific weapon or vehicle (AT, MANPADs, IFVs, etc...) They are also the reason why many missions do not scale well.

 

I am not saying that every mission that is a meeting engagement, have HVTs, or that has assets are bad or that every infantry based attack/defend is the tits. There are just so many examples that show that things could be done better and many mission makers are oblivious of that or just outright ignore it. To the point where their new mission is a complete gamble of whether its shit or not.

 

@Freddy

Sewage comes in a lot of varieties too but at the end of the day we are still swimming in shit. I think that the community would benefit if the MM office rejected mission submissions based on whether they are shit. Rather than rejection for technical issues or the lack of version number, then we could have the variety as well as more solid missions that are enjoyable for everyone.

 

@Pax

The dying (dead?) fish that is UOTC does not have the will to introduce and train players in the way which UO plays Arma. It has not flopped around consistently, only when a member decides to do something about it rather than making forum posts and threads does UOTC give the impression that it can still make it into the water. This usually happens for a week or maybe even a month, but then courses stop and people go back to being mean to each other on the internet. As for the missions; if UO can't provide a solid, fun and enjoyable experience through the missions then how can we expect players to want to learn, get better and stick around? 

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@Freddy

Sewage comes in a lot of varieties too but at the end of the day we are still swimming in shit. I think that the community would benefit if the MM office rejected mission submissions based on whether they are shit. Rather than rejection for technical issues or the lack of version number, then we could have the variety as well as more solid missions that are enjoyable for everyone.

 

 

Who makes the decision if a scenario is unsuitable? If a mission is shit (i.e. not fun or commonly liked) it will not be played. Mission selection is subjective, some like different types of missions and variety is the key to creating a sustainable pool of missions to select from.

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The problem is that after the server dies for whatever reason, and only 2-3 people are playing, no one joins, because there are only 2-3 people playing, and so the server stays dead. What we need are more scheduled events, as well as just a bunch of people getting together and hopping on the server at the same time to bring some life back to it. We should at least try to have one scheduled event every month, such as a TVT madhouse, an I44 event, something like that. It would work wonders.

Edited by TheReaper1221

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We should at least try to have one scheduled event every month, such as a TVT madhouse, an I44 event, something like that. It would work wonders.

 

That would help, I think an I44 event is way overdue, I44 is always reliable in drawing the masses.

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That would help, I think an I44 event is way overdue, I44 is always reliable in drawing the masses.

Good luck making it work.

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So this is now a thing...

 

Wrong ArmA video

 

YES, i was there for this. This was the best thing I ever witnessed here.

 

on reddit, etc.) personally, I think when RHS comes out for A3 playing A2 is going to be useless, and that we can then run events. By running large events people will see our server in the browser and want to join. With new people the server will grow and we can go back to debating stupid

issues.

 

Attitudes are on the server are irrelevant, people who play are irrelevant, isn't this post about united operations being empty? 

 

 

 

I think the MM office should do this but that's just me.

 

 

the MM office does regulate missions, they also have a small testing team which tests problem mission maker's missions. The MM office also has some SOPs that you agree to when you post the mission. The MM office ATM is falling apart. People who do it are busy in real life, and no one is attempting to take their positions, not like the people who work there really accept help anyway :\

 

 

 

 

 

That would help, I think an I44 event is way overdue, I44 is always reliable in drawing the masses.

 
Secondly, what Mr. Moneybags is trying to say fred is that I44, while fun and all, is very broken atm. Huge lag issues. I'm not sure when Kingslayer last tested this, but it's running info atm that the mod itself is borked because of arma2's state.
 
 
 
 
 

The problem is that after the server dies for whatever reason

 
This is because people just leave, some get bored, some have things to do. I always see the server empty out at nearly the same time, and it has been like this ever since we started this community.  I'd suggest you make a poll asking people these things so we can get some metrics.
 
 
 
Damn, i'm so bored from playing A2 i'm on the forums posting shit. When RHS comes out, I'll be mission making and playing away. so if you reference my meme's from the other day, I'll be the guy who's rotted away and is a skeleton.
Edited by HeadShot

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That would help, I think an I44 event is way overdue, I44 is always reliable in drawing the masses.

 

A good alternative to an I44 event would be an Iron Front event on Arma 3. Unlike I44, Iron Front is of much higher quality, was professionally developed, and actually works. The only problem is that while it is a mod, it is required that you buy the standalone game in order to gain access to the Arma 3 mod.

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@Dackery - Pretty much.

 

I think you guys should promote UO, think about positive advertising. AFAIK the PR office has been busy IRL, so it's left to people like us to promote the server. None of that lets talk bulshit on the forms and try to get people to join, but actually run PR on websites.  (i.e Vidoes on youtube, posts on reddit, etc.)

Please, do not do this.

Seriously, do not do this, as it only causes more problems and drama.

 

 

I44 will most likely not ever be ran as an event for ArmA 2 ever again due to how poorly it runs since the 1.63 update.

 

Cross community events for A2 are no longer being perused due to lack of participation by other communities having moved on to ArmA3, and or being on hold until other mods are updated.

The last 4 events that we have had planned all have fallen though over the last 6 months, and thus we are no longer persusing any more ArmA 2 events at this time.

 

In all honestly I would rather we die down a fair bit, lose the players that are not interested, and then reestablish ourselves later in ArmA 3.

There are other games that people are playing within the community and that have been being played consistently and well to community standards.

While not all of these games may have had the same level of attention that ArmA 2 has had in the past within the community that is not to say that we are looking to shut down it down at this point.

 

ArmA 2 servers will be marginalized over the next few months and we will most likely shut down SRV2 - Alt and SRV4Test 2, in addition to the Training Servers (SRV5/6), short of training sessions.

ArmA 3, should the community choose to focus on it will be given more priority once there are more missions and content created for it. Pending it's continued development and stability.

 

We are not seeking to run any ArmA 3 events with external communities at this time as we can not field any event level missions from our existing mission base, nor would the rush to create an event level mission be desired, when the existing community does not play ArmA3 in large enough numbers yet.

 

I can try to continue this a bit later when I am not at work sometime this weekend.

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isn't this post about united operations being empty

It is about WHY it is empty.

But filling UO with more uneducated players while having no structures or rules in the SOPs which target it is to get new ones and keep current users educated, until that happend, getting new players to UO is a wortless target.

And anyways: Videos and all that other stuff are useless. Do you want to attract dipshits and derpers? When people hear due to moth-to-mouth propaganda that UO has an immersive and high milsim standard than the people we actually want to have here, will join on their own without any further work necessary. That is why I joined back then. Not because of Youtube videos or people advertising in forums. I entered the following in google search back then: "milsim arma2 ace acre" and one of the first entries was forums.unitedoperations.net.

Try it today. UO is not even shown on the first page anymore.

 

 

In all honesty I would rather we die down a fair bit, lose the players that are not interested, and then reestablish ourselves later in ArmA 3.

Quality over Quantity - I could not agree more.

But do not forget that quality needs to be ensured.

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"PR thingy i wrote"

Please, do not do this.

Seriously, do not do this, as it only causes more problems and drama.

 

 -yeah, I took that bit out. Slept on it, meant just make vids but it wasn't worded how I wanted, but we should def leave PR it to the pros.  :happy: 

 

 

Quality over Quantity - I could not agree more.

 

Yet everyone is say "Oh UO is dead and empty". uneducated player become educated players. What should we only accept people in the military because those are the only really educated one we can take, without having to teach. o/

We have a disciplinary system in place to deal with people, which if need be can permanently remove them. UOTC can educate new players. It is possible to both have quality and quantity. In the past, when we started this community, we took on new players. We had highs and lows of player counts, but in all this time when people enforced the rules/SOPs and leadership acted like it nothing stupid happened, much. UO has been the same since we created this community, sometimes quality goes down; because like i said interest dies, and those who enforce it do not play; this unfortunately means Pax you're getting the short straw. I still consider you new, and we've discussed the issue of quality over quantity many times. A balance can be struck through enforcing rules period That is why they exist, that is why we have changeable SOPs, and a modifiable charter. All that remains is to wait for A3.

 

 

A good alternative to an I44 event would be an Iron Front event on Arma 3. Unlike I44, Iron Front is of much higher quality, was professionally developed, and actually works. The only problem is that while it is a mod, it is required that you buy the standalone game in order to gain access to the Arma 3 mod.

 

 

Talk to me on TS, but does this work on A3 ? I thought it was still being developed.

 

 

Is it that time of year again?

 

 

Yup.

 

 

p.s., is there a double space feature on the forums? doing it manually doesn't really work well.

Edited by HeadShot

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Arma 2 is dead; as fun of a game Arma 2 is there is only so many times you can play the same missions before you're bored silly as I'm sure many of the old regulars can attest to. When you combine that with an extreme drop in both the skill level and sheer attitude of players on the server and factor in to the time of the year the will to populate it just isn't there.

 

If you want decent ARMA gameplay come play A3. In some ways it feels like the community has returned to it's roots with better-quality medium missions. It isn't a 24/7 populated server but UO has been down that path, is it one we want to be hurrying down now? Hopefully, as new missions are created and the modpack stabilizes the play sessions of Arma 3 should hopefully increase in frequency.

 

Until then you are free to come and play the plethora of other games we play here at UO, just hop into a barracks channel and see if anyone is playing things.

 

100% agreed. The skill level and maturity of folks playing Arma 3 right now is what I joined for.

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It seems that every time this discussion pops up, so many related semi-related issues get lumped in right away and the discussion seems to get "scope-creeped" to death.

 

Sure, server population, quality of play, updates (ArmA 3 transition), training, regular habits, and player attitudes are very connected issues that affect each other and any discussion should consider how they are related.

 

However, rejecting solutions to each problem just because they don't address other problems at the same time doesn't really go anywhere. At that point you may be unintentionally asking for an all-in-one solution that doesn't exist simply because nobody here is super-human.

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 rejecting solutions

 

the real purpose of these forum, also speak for yourself as I'm definitely superhuman

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ArmA 2 is a dead game minus a few Day Z mods. The game is old and people have lost interest. It's really as simple as that. Like Impulse said, this is just the way things are going to be until UO attempts to make the full move over to ArmA 3 and then re establishes itself. The glory days of 100+ people on the server could return, but that won't happen until we are an ArmA 3 community. I've been itching for some ArmA lately and I would love to come back for ArmA 3. I miss you guys, even the ones that can't stand me!

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we miss you too sickly. RHS comes out soon, and many people are looking forward to that.

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Yes, let those warm waves of nostalgia wash over you.

 

No, the quality of play was better. Sometimes it was different, and not every game was at the right quality, but nowadays even when Tactical Tuesday was running the quality was still shit. It's shit every game I've played, and the only times I've had "good" experiences is when I've been shielded from the majority of the playerbase by a command appoint. You have to turn a blind eye to many things to think that quality of play is still as good as it was.

 

Being in a rifle squad in the past year so is the most tortuous gaming experience of my life. Herding cats is the right term.

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Being in a rifle squad in the past year so is the most tortuous gaming experience of my life. Herding cats is the right term.

 

Don't be so dramatic, it just makes you look like a whiner. Also, I have NEVER seen you play Herbiie, not once and I have played a lot over the last year and a half, almost every day that the server was populated. Sometimes it got silly, sometimes people were unresponsive, but the vast majority of times, they were capable enough to do what they were told and only whined when missions went on for too long due to incompetence at the higher command level.

 

I don't know what kind of quality you are expecting, especially when the people that are supposed to enforce quality rarely play and the general attitude of this community is a fucking nightmare of cynicism and just plain rudeness. I can not remember the last time I saw a forum post that did not draw some sort of argument between two members, usually, the argument started with one of the older members (many times regulars) saying something very rude and very unsuitable for what is supposed to be the face and soul of our community, then they decided to go back and edit out the really bad parts, as if nothing happened.

 

This is not saying all Regulars are rude or cynical, just that at times it seems like the quality of the Regular is not being upheld.

 

I'm sure this post (if anyone reads it) will draw that kind of reply.

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