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Thawk

[Discussion] ARMA Barrier to Entry Concept

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I'm a little concerned about this proposal. I took the familiarization course-twice. But I typically play during Pacific time because that is most convenient for me. There are very few who have taken the familiarization course, simply because it is never offered during this time.

 

Yes, the proposal grants the possibility of 1 on 1 training, but  how will that work for an entire group of people that never had access to any training?

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I voiced similar concerns previously in the thread Recondo.  To be fair to Thawk, there is a month transition period for players to pass the barrier to entry - it still remains to be seen how many sessions will be run at convenient times for all of UO, and how sustainable these sessions are beyond the initial month.  I'll be waiting to see the detailed plans for this before commenting any further.

Edited by Rofl3r

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I think a course like this has the potential to better the gameplay as well. I've noticed over the past few months a crazy decrease in the quality of play, probably related to people getting out of school. Even so, it's been very frustrating with people not understanding the style of gameplay and seemingly not wanting to learn.

 

I think this could be a great thing if people were able to be around certain times of day. I placed my name in to potentially help as a BSS instructor. I'm currently in Eastern side of the US, but could definitely try to make time to help people from the West in small groups during the weeks and weekends if I am selected to help.

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I'm all for the BSS. If we simply had more courses for the later timezones, we probably wouldn't need any kind of barrier.

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If you go through the ban forum you will find that incompetence, disregard for rules, inability to to read and understand the basics and rules of a community you play at and general asshole behaviour transcendence time zones. So having more courses for a US time zone would not solve anything.

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J.B. I think their concern is that there won't be any courses run for this within their timezones therefore they will not be able to play on the server.

 

Currently courses are only being run by UOTC, whereas with this there will be a larger number of instructors (they only have to teach 1 course after all), so the courses will be run more frequently & in more time zones, don't worry guys.

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Theres a pretty simple solution to your worry about not having courses in your time zone

 

Sign up to be an instructor!!

 

You dont have to be a Regular to be a BSS instructor, so if your concerned about not having courses in your TZ, sign up to be an instructor and maybe become part of a solution instead of a pointing out problems?

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Theres a pretty simple solution to your worry about not having courses in your time zone

 

Sign up to be an instructor!!

 

You dont have to be a Regular to be a BSS instructor, so if your concerned about not having courses in your TZ, sign up to be an instructor and maybe become part of a solution instead of a pointing out problems?

That is part of my plan but I am still pretty new here. I'll take the famil course one more time and after that I will apply to become an assistant.

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Why not implement this for 6 months and see if it helps? Have to say as a noob, I have been dissapointed at times at the lack of seriousness on the server. I want to learn while many others are goofing off. Also would like to see more activity on the training server. Even just some impromptu squad tactics or weapons famil training. With or without regulars.

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Why not implement this for 6 months and see if it helps? Have to say as a noob, I have been dissapointed at times at the lack of seriousness on the server. I want to learn while many others are goofing off. Also would like to see more activity on the training server. Even just some impromptu squad tactics or weapons famil training. With or without regulars.

Totally agree, the lack of seriousness on the server is driving me crazy sometimes and I just rage quit because its taking the fun away if people in your team are just not taking anything seriously. 

 

About the training, a good way is to hop on the teamspeak and just ask some people if they want to train or try out some stuff with you, players are very helpful here! If you see me on teamspeak, feel free to poke me, im always up for a nice training session and learing some new stuff!

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Bodei this is still being planned, it takes a while to iron out all of the problems so that when it is introduced it is as good as it can be. Rushing things will not help.

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Totally agree, the lack of seriousness on the server is driving me crazy sometimes and I just rage quit because its taking the fun away if people in your team are just not taking anything seriously. 

You can only imagine what it's like Pacific time at night when no regulars are around...

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There is talk between myself and Krause to see what we can do with the two concepts.

 

In relation to the discussion between Recondo, O'Neill and Bodei. You are all more than capable to report any wrong doings on the forum. It doesn't even have to be a ban request. You make a thread in the ARMA 2 forum, you name the players and you write the disruption. It will be handled from there.

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What can I do if disruption is the norm? One time, everyone else agreed to put up a dogfighting mission. Since I have no business piloting jets, I was only able to watch the explosions from the top of the control tower. They are nice guys but they do not know what they are doing.

Edited by Recondo

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Report it. Everything that is against our values, you report it. Even if you are the lone person of 25 on the server who isn't taking part in the derp. You are still in the right. The community can only improve with a joint effort from everyone.

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They know what the rules and sops are if they have ever looked for the password themselves.  They are simply choosing to ignore them.   
Report it and try to help out the server/community by not letting that stay the norm.

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...

I think that a portion of either the END of the course or the BEGINNING should emphasize the importance of REPUTATION. Similarly within real-life a first impression can never be taken back. Within this community in the Regular forums we have many a thread dedicated to individuals exhibiting their faults as well as their triumphs. There should be a part of this course that exemplifies the fact that all we have to base people on is their own inherent reputation and the way they carry themselves. Regardless of courses completed, status, experience, time in UO, or what have you, reputation here reigns supreme in my mind.

...

Three fucking cheers man. Very well said.

Combine this with Rambo's suggestion and meld it into a 15min video with a Q/A sign off by a qualified Reg/Member. I think we'll have a great, short intro and set of expectations the new player will understand while not delaying entry by a substantial means into playing the game.

 

 

 

What I want you to teach these guys is that they will know what NOT to do. For example, they should follow their leader (SL, FTL, buddy), they should NOT run on their own. They should listen to their leader. They should complete the task given by their leader to the best of their abilities. They should NOT disrupt slotting by talking or slotting into slots that are not called. They should NOT yell, harass etc. They should understand that if they are in a important position, that they have a responsibility (PL, SL, assets). They should know that they will not be tolerated if they come up with disruptive plans...

 

 

Just a quick point to note, when you first started playing at UO, what did that look like? Did a friend get you to join the server one night, show you around and babysit you a little bit until you could operate on your own? Did you stumble upon a populated server that emphasized Maturity, Friendship, Fun, Professionalism, Respect, Cooperation, Teamwork and Courtesy and decide, yes, this is where i want to play? In both instances, you (download gigs upon gigs) load up and then you're at the mercy of the people around you showing you the ropes (and hopefully find a few with the patience not to strangle you with said rope).

 

If you want to require an introduction to UO, might it make sense to watch a demo video while in the waiting room, have an 'instructor' ask you some questions to test for knowledge of the video's content, update a tag and be on the server? I personally see an issue where a new player has to wait for an instructor to hold a class in order to join the server. Could it be they get a same day class, sure. Could it be 2 days before an instructor is online when that player is? A week? Lets not forget about real life schedules. On the same vein, I don't believe its fair to require instructors to be spending 40min to an hour doing this   every   single   day  .

 

TL:dr 

- Shorter video, instructor to 'test for knowledge' prior to server access.

- Video content to focus on Expectations while on the server. Highlight player reputation as a key aspect to playing on the server.

- Keep scope of video in check - this is to set expectations, not a 'new to ARMA' tutorial.

- There will always be new players, treat them with respect and give them a chance to learn instead of leaving them to break SOP without first knowing it.

Edited by ThirdSin

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Just a quick point to note, when you first started playing at UO, what did that look like? Did a friend get you to join the server one night, show you around and babysit you a little bit until you could operate on your own? Did you stumble upon a populated server that emphasized Maturity, Friendship, Fun, Professionalism, Respect, Cooperation, Teamwork and Courtesy and decide, yes, this is where i want to play? In both instances, you (download gigs upon gigs) load up and then you're at the mercy of the people around you showing you the ropes (and hopefully find a few with the patience not to strangle you with said rope).

 

If you want to require an introduction to UO, might it make sense to watch a demo video while in the waiting room, have an 'instructor' ask you some questions to test for knowledge of the video's content, update a tag and be on the server? I personally see an issue where a new player has to wait for an instructor to hold a class in order to join the server. Could it be they get a same day class, sure. Could it be 2 days before an instructor is online when that player is? A week? Lets not forget about real life schedules. On the same vein, I don't believe its fair to require instructors to be spending 40min to an hour doing this   every   single   day  .

 

TL:dr 

- Shorter video, instructor to 'test for knowledge' prior to server access.

- Video content to focus on Expectations while on the server. Highlight player reputation as a key aspect to playing on the server.

- Keep scope of video in check - this is to set expectations, not a 'new to ARMA' tutorial.

- There will always be new players, treat them with respect and give them a chance to learn instead of leaving them to break SOP without first knowing it.

When I started playing at UO for the first night, I was one of the lucky ones who had a friend show me the ropes. Even so, I was pretty far out of my element and ACRE was busted (causing me to actually reload my OS to play at UO). I think it'd be nice for there to be a short demo video and then someone (with the ability to grant the fag) asks them some questions and just does their best to make sure they are here for the right reasons. I think this should be tasked to regulars and a few subset of trusted members (ex regulars, and other trusted players).
 
This may be off-topic a bit, but what needs to be done to get the Getting Started article updated? We could maybe have some wording and a video in here to explain the things we feel we need to explain before people try to play on UO.
 
Should we consider switching the article to reference PlayWithSix? It's the future of things, and it would avoid player frustration especially with the recent cases of manual intervention required to get on the server. In addition to that, the getting started article (last time I looked) is missing very important configuration pieces such setting the binding used for whisper control. 
 

Sorry for the half-thread-hijack, I just thought it might be sensible to do both at once.

 

//heckman

Edited by Heckman

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I find the idea of a "Demo Video" quite half-hearted and pathetic frankly.

 

Learning from a video is as bad as just reading a page from a field manual and then saying you know how to use mortars. You need to have actually done stuff to have learnt it, you need to be able to ask questions and will generally learn a lot more, a lot quicker if you are with an actual instructor. Also how do you find out that they HAVE actually watched the entire video? Questions are not a very reliable way of showing this.

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I find the idea of a "Demo Video" quite half-hearted and pathetic frankly.

 

Learning from a video is as bad as just reading a page from a field manual and then saying you know how to use mortars. You need to have actually done stuff to have learnt it, you need to be able to ask questions and will generally learn a lot more, a lot quicker if you are with an actual instructor. Also how do you find out that they HAVE actually watched the entire video? Questions are not a very reliable way of showing this.

Agreed.  How long before a "answers to UO entry" cheat sheet appears somewhere on the internet?  Original proposal is better IMO.

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 I don't want people to write about how to use acre. I would like to actually hear them on the radio after telling them what channel to be on.

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Gentlemen,

 

This is an announcement that I will be holding a meeting on Teamspeak within the UOTC channels this coming Friday at 20:00 Zulu. This is the OP of this thread, the google docs link is pretty much mandatory reading if you're going to show up. Also please note, the polled B2E was not my actual concept, it was a modified version.

 

 

United Operations ARMA Barrier to Entry Concept
Aim: To create the smallest barrier of entry possible to UO in an attempt to improve overall standard of play, as well as minimising overall admin load.

Objective 1: Develop a Basic Soldiering Skills course
Objective 2: Modify charter to allow implementation of concept
Objective 3: Physical modifications of primary and TS as well as briefing to Regulars.

This concept is being put forward in an attempt to solve the degrading play of the primary server whilst minimizing the bureaucratic effort of Officers and UOTC Instructors. This short document has been prepared and reviewed by many of the key players here at UO. Readers have the ability to place small comment on portions and I can provide a reply to them personally. Otherwise, you can reply more comprehensively here.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1QIlGfn8wc2w2fKrXddFYq1k4tcLiuLzIUZwdnmGy55M/edit?usp=sharing

 

 

 

Please note, this is not a friendly open debate. People can air their concerns but don't expect a compromise at every corner. Saying that, all are welcome and if there is enough demand I will change date or time to attempt to suit the majority. For those who have read the google docs and are interested in a BSS Instructor position, the form is here: https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1RSCOLk2SKfEZXAjUCpWZgWt5Dm23hkCA3XYHrY0T5A0/viewform

 

To quickly check if you have signed up, here is a list of responses:

Thawk, KassRed, ClintUK, Edwards, Macaco, Enex, Ghost19z, Haribo, GreenDemon, Elesium, Robijn, The BrentP, AC 337, St.Sabath, Skalbairn, Dezel, Zedic, Fighter, BLARGH, Gabe, VPope, Fox D, Nathan423, Jethro, Fattierob, scallops, *No Name*, Heckman, j0hnanderson, Recondo, JakCurse, Aphex, buddytex, DrHonig.

 

Struck out names are people who filled out the from but answered no to a question, submitted a joke entry, or had an error of some sort.

Edited by Thawk

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